Re: It will take a lot of hands to pull heads out of dark places Kenzi! :-)

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Posted by Kenzi on September 20, 2001 at 00:11:00:

In reply to: Re: It will take a lot of hands to pull heads out of dark places Kenzi! :-) posted by Robert on September 19, 2001 at 14:50:57:

: God help you all. If you think praying is going to help you against
: terrorist. And shame on you for implying that USA is some sort of

Some people do feel it will help and there is nothing wrong with
that. If all it does is give them comfort, then prayer is an
essential thing right now.

way
: responsible for the deaths that occurred last week, that you bombed
: yourself. Shame. When a person says the United States "had it
: coming," what he or she means is that murder is a morally
appropriate
: rejoinder to a perceived slight or injustice. To imply that
: bringing to justice people like Mussolini, Hitler, bin Laden,
people
: who wish to exterminate whole cultures, to say that to go to war to
: save the Jews from concentration camps is the definition of
: stupidity, well that is a stunning comment.

Certainly the US didn't have this coming or deserve, but it did do a
lot in the world in the past that could be said to have led to this
attack. The US supports Israel at all costs and denies that the
Palestinians have any rights; this angers muslims who believe that
Palestinians DO have rights (it angers non-muslims as well) and makes
them hate the US.

In an effort to get one over on the Soviet Union we supported any
Afghani rebel group against the Soviet Union, actions which led to
the growth and the arming of the Taliban with US funding. There was
a feeling that perhaps the US was on the side of the Aghani rebels
because they believed in their cause and wanted to support it, but as
soon as the Soviets pulled out the US also pulled its support showing
the Afghanis that they were just a Cold War pawn. Bin Laden himself
received training from the CIA.

The US did not deserve to be attacked like this, but it does need to
look at its actions and try to answer the question "why do certain
groups hate us so much as to murder innocent people".

:
: Vengeance is always a base desire; in this case it is also
: impractical. We obviously wouldn't wipe out an equal number of
: innocent civilians -- not if we wished to be just, and not if we
: wished to retain the moral high ground. And if we limited ourselves
: to taking out Osama bin Laden, we should find such retaliation
: neither commensurate with the wrong done to us, nor effective in
: preventing future atrocities. Culpable though he may be in this
: attack, and critical as he undoubtedly is to the terrorist cause
: generally, there are plenty more where he came from. We must fight
a
: war against all terrorist.

I agree with you here. I fear further retaliation if we kill Bin
Laden or attack Afghanistan; there must be other less lethal ways of
bringing this "war" to an end.

Follow Ups

Re: It will take a lot of hands to pull heads out of dark places Kenzi! :-) Robert 17:26:36 9/20/2001 (5)
- Re: It will take a lot of hands to pull heads out of dark places Kenzi! :-) Kenzi 18:01:06 9/20/2001 (4)
  - Re: It will take a lot of hands to pull heads out of dark places Kenzi! :-) WHO IS THIS KENZI? SHE HAS NO IDEA 14:32:45 10/2/2001 (0)
  - Re: It will take a lot of hands to pull heads out of dark places Kenzi! :-) Is that sarcasim A lurker 18:06:25 9/28/2001 (0)
  - Please reply Robert 16:57:52 9/24/2001 (0)
  - Perhaps the BBC can explain it better than I can Kenzi 22:49:31 9/20/2001 (0)

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: : God help you all. If you think praying is going to help you against : : terrorist. And shame on you for implying that USA is some sort of : : Some people do feel it will help and there is nothing wrong with : that. If all it does is give them comfort, then prayer is an : essential thing right now. : : way : : responsible for the deaths that occurred last week, that you bombed : : yourself. Shame. When a person says the United States "had it : : coming," what he or she means is that murder is a morally : appropriate : : rejoinder to a perceived slight or injustice. To imply that : : bringing to justice people like Mussolini, Hitler, bin Laden, : people : : who wish to exterminate whole cultures, to say that to go to war to : : save the Jews from concentration camps is the definition of : : stupidity, well that is a stunning comment. : : Certainly the US didn't have this coming or deserve, but it did do a : lot in the world in the past that could be said to have led to this : attack. The US supports Israel at all costs and denies that the : Palestinians have any rights; this angers muslims who believe that : Palestinians DO have rights (it angers non-muslims as well) and makes : them hate the US. : : In an effort to get one over on the Soviet Union we supported any : Afghani rebel group against the Soviet Union, actions which led to : the growth and the arming of the Taliban with US funding. There was : a feeling that perhaps the US was on the side of the Aghani rebels : because they believed in their cause and wanted to support it, but as : soon as the Soviets pulled out the US also pulled its support showing : the Afghanis that they were just a Cold War pawn. Bin Laden himself : received training from the CIA. : : The US did not deserve to be attacked like this, but it does need to : look at its actions and try to answer the question "why do certain : groups hate us so much as to murder innocent people". : : : : : Vengeance is always a base desire; in this case it is also : : impractical. We obviously wouldn't wipe out an equal number of : : innocent civilians -- not if we wished to be just, and not if we : : wished to retain the moral high ground. And if we limited ourselves : : to taking out Osama bin Laden, we should find such retaliation : : neither commensurate with the wrong done to us, nor effective in : : preventing future atrocities. Culpable though he may be in this : : attack, and critical as he undoubtedly is to the terrorist cause : : generally, there are plenty more where he came from. We must fight : a : : war against all terrorist. : : I agree with you here. I fear further retaliation if we kill Bin : Laden or attack Afghanistan; there must be other less lethal ways of : bringing this "war" to an end.
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